Totally Sad About "R" rating :-(


Author Topic: Totally Sad About "R" rating :-(  (Read 6069 times)

Rohan

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Re: Totally Sad About "R" rating :-(
« Reply #30 on: May 21, 2008, 05:50:40 PM »
Gore is not the issue at hand. I already stated how to properly use it in an earlier post.

SADISM IS THE ISSUE.

And this isn't just about Eli Roth. This is about all the depraved men who have done similar things.

I'm not taking this too seriously. It's a really, really big deal that men are able to make such despicable works of "art", and an even bigger deal that thousands of people will pay him for it.

Rohan, a work of art is a piece of a person's soul. Can't you see that? Art is the heartfelt expression of a sentient being. A sunset is the handiwork of God. I'm currently writing a story, and it's an expression of what is in my soul.

Can't you see what Eli Roth's art says about himself?


I want to see the world change so, so bad. I'm finding it difficult to express that right now. Just thinking about the state our race has been in for thousands of years chokes me up.

I'll push a million people like Eli Roth off a cliff just to change the world. I'll even go down with them.

A changed world is all I want.

We can't have a changed world when people across the globe are being spoon-fed DEATH by men like Eli Roth through entertainment.

Crashing a plane full of people into a building full of people isn't the worst thing a man can do. That is merely a destruction of the body.

The worst thing a man can do, Rohan, is destroy another man's soul.

If I find a way to end it, then by God, I will.

Maybe men will stop crashing planes full of people into buildings full of people when movies glorifying murder are no longer considered acceptable.

Well, I have nothing more to say. I am just saying that Eli Roth is just a film maker that's all. I understand your point of view, but Eli is not a killer. For example, an author can write about war and stuff, but it doesn't mean he is a killer or the one who started the war. Eli made few movies about serial killers or sick people, that doesn't make him a killer or a bad person. He is a great guy.

Rohan

Mr_Glass.1

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Re: Totally Sad About "R" rating :-(
« Reply #31 on: May 21, 2008, 06:55:49 PM »
Unbroken, I think you are being a bit too brutal.  You call a man who rams himself into a building killing others terrorists, and think they should be executed.  But they're doing it because they think it's what their god demands.  They are following their moral guide.  You want to push men like Eli Roth off a cliff because of you moral beliefs, but how does that seperate you from the terrorists. To defend a man's body against attack, that is fine, then I don't have a problem with killing people.  But to get to a man's soul, you have to approach him talk to him like a man, get to know him and try and change him in his heart, not by killing him, there is a difference between spiritual defense and physical defense.  I have a moral problem with slasher films, but if you murder their makers, isn't that exactly what they're putting forward in their films.  You kill them, more men like them will come along, but you change them and you've changed a person soul. 
I see the world Lucius Hunt, just not the way you see it.


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Dr Malcolm Crowe

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Re: Totally Sad About "R" rating :-(
« Reply #32 on: May 21, 2008, 07:32:04 PM »
Well said Mr_Glass

Rohan

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Re: Totally Sad About "R" rating :-(
« Reply #33 on: May 21, 2008, 08:18:00 PM »
Unbroken, I think you are being a bit too brutal.  You call a man who rams himself into a building killing others terrorists, and think they should be executed.  But they're doing it because they think it's what their god demands.  They are following their moral guide.  You want to push men like Eli Roth off a cliff because of you moral beliefs, but how does that seperate you from the terrorists. To defend a man's body against attack, that is fine, then I don't have a problem with killing people.  But to get to a man's soul, you have to approach him talk to him like a man, get to know him and try and change him in his heart, not by killing him, there is a difference between spiritual defense and physical defense.  I have a moral problem with slasher films, but if you murder their makers, isn't that exactly what they're putting forward in their films.  You kill them, more men like them will come along, but you change them and you've changed a person soul. 

I am impressed. Well, said.

Rohan

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Re: Totally Sad About "R" rating :-(
« Reply #34 on: May 22, 2008, 07:55:59 AM »
Unbroken, I think you are being a bit too brutal.  You call a man who rams himself into a building killing others terrorists, and think they should be executed.  But they're doing it because they think it's what their god demands.  They are following their moral guide.  You want to push men like Eli Roth off a cliff because of you moral beliefs, but how does that seperate you from the terrorists. To defend a man's body against attack, that is fine, then I don't have a problem with killing people.  But to get to a man's soul, you have to approach him talk to him like a man, get to know him and try and change him in his heart, not by killing him, there is a difference between spiritual defense and physical defense.  I have a moral problem with slasher films, but if you murder their makers, isn't that exactly what they're putting forward in their films.  You kill them, more men like them will come along, but you change them and you've changed a person soul. 

Very well put Mr_Glass! 

I understand where you're coming from Unbroken, and appreciate the heart behind your passion.  However, Mr_Glass makes a good point here about dealing with what's inside of people instead of just "offing" people based on their external actions. 
"See what you have to ask yourself is what kind of person are you? Are you the kind that sees signs, sees miracles? Or do you believe that people just get lucky?"

I'm a "Signs" person.

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Re: Totally Sad About "R" rating :-(
« Reply #35 on: May 22, 2008, 08:38:45 AM »
Thanks,  :), I'm a Christian and I feel God led me to say that, but that is something I also feel very passionately about.
I see the world Lucius Hunt, just not the way you see it.


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Unbroken

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Re: Totally Sad About "R" rating :-(
« Reply #36 on: May 22, 2008, 09:20:26 AM »
I understand where most of you are coming from with this; it's the mainstream view of things and I honestly don't believe I can convince many people that the type of action I've described is what needs to be done.

Please understand, my sole ambition is not the killing of Eli Roth! You guys now probably think I'm some kind of obsessed freak, but really, I'm not. I've defended my position astutely, but really I could argue just as strongly about something far less controversial.

It's just a point of view. I don't sit around planning how to kill people I think are bad.


To those of you who believe I should approach men like Eli Roth and try to convince him that what he's doing is wrong, I don't have a problem with that, but do you seriously think it will work? If what I've said is true, that Eli Roth's mind is no different than a sadist, is he any more likely to stop than a real serial killer?

Can you imagine David Dunn walking into the room where that sicko was spitting alcohol on a hurt woman's cut wrists and saying "hey man, please remain calm, I'm going to turn you over to the authorities. You need serious help. This is all probably coming from an abusive childhood..."

David Dunn killed that man. (He really did: pause the movie when he skoots the newspaper over to his son and zoom in on it.) Some people would say it's okay because the man was a murderer, and he deserved it. I say it was okay because he deserved it and he was someone who's mind was so incredibly twisted, there was no hope for him. None. He had to go because he was a threat to his fellow man, and Eli Roth is a threat too. His mind is twisted, and I don't think you could convince him otherwise,.

Rohan here thinks what he does is art. If I can't convince him that it's wrong, how could I convince the man who actually does it?

Mr Glass 1, "murdering" sick film makers is not copying what is in their films. Not unless I tie them up and kill them very, very slowly, using scalpels, saws, and lots of other nasty sharp objects. There is a big difference between that and a quick shove. Or the push of a button that says "eliminate all sadists".

Dr. M Crowe, let me clarify what I said about "maybe men will stop crashing planes full of people into buildings full of people when movies glorifying murder are no longer considered acceptable."

What I meant by that was is we can't allow one type of evil to flourish and think that stomping a different evil out will change things. It ALL has to go, because both types of depravity feed eachother. We can't be double minded like that. If we kill all the terrorists in the world, but let ordinary people gunk up their brains with reeking decay, what do you think will end up happening all over again?

The cycle will continue! Why are people so nonsensically murdered day after day in America? Because we've bought the lie that as long as you contain and fill your mind with evil, it won't affect your actions. But it has! America wasn't always this way! How did everything all the sudden go so wrong?? Why are innocent people shot and stabbed by men, and sometimes children who have never been wronged by their victims?!

It's because we haven't yet come to realize that mere ideas have consequences. Long term, big consequences.


Gruesome entertainment and rituals have been part of human civilization from nearly the beginning of time. The Romans didn't just pit armed slaves at eachother; they rolled entire Christian families in pitch, and then set them alight in the arena. "Entertainmant".

The Aztecs at one time in their "golden age" sacrificed as many as 8000 men a day on their pyramids. The dried blood was so thick on the steps, that they had entire teams of men devoted to continually scraping the blood off with huge troughs so the priests wouldn't slip and crack their skulls on their way up to the top.

The Nazis thought it was "fun" to kill Jews. They came up with all sorts of interesting ways to end Jews' lives in their concentration camps. Apparently just shooting the Jews was too boring. Instead they strapped them down onto slates and rolled them into ovens.


You people have to understand, it all comes from the same place. The abstract WILL manifest itself in the material world through human hands. What starts out as an idea will become a belief, and a belief will be made real eventually. And countless other people will be maimed by that simple, "unreal", fictional idea that started in one man's twisted mind.


I rest my case.


Thank you all for sharing your points of view.


And please remember, I'm not going to kill anybody.

There are a hundred other ways to change the world. I already know which course I'm going to take.

I just really wouldn't mind if someone pushed the "eliminate all sadists" button sometime soon. It could make a really big difference.

mamasan

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Re: Totally Sad About "R" rating :-(
« Reply #37 on: May 22, 2008, 11:23:50 AM »
Look Dr. M Crowe, the reason I'd push Eli Roth off a cliff (and I think I really could) is not because I want to do him "violence" for his disgusting movies, but because I want to put an end to the things he creates. If there was a button that said "eliminate all sadists" next to your key-board, would you seriously not push it?


After you finish making excuses for the deadly actions you feel are worthwhile and/or justifiable, Unbroken, pray tell: what part of "Thou shalt not kill" don't you understand?

You're not talking about self-defense or accidental killing. (David Dunn killed the serial killer in self-defense; Ray killed Graham's wife accidentally.) You're talking about murder.

To me, you sound like just another petty tyrant, pounding his chest and drowning in arrogance. And you sound as little like M. Night Shyamalan and his films as I can imagine any person being. Have you no humility? Do you ever really examine your ideas other than looking for ways to prove that you are right?

You enlightened all of us here on the forum as to when murder is justified. Thank you very much. We were wondering.

--Oh, wait. I stand corrected. You actually only rationalized the murder of "sadists" and the like. But you, conveniently, get to decide who they are.  ....To be honest, now that I've written this, I still can't decide whether to be afraid of your mentality or to laugh at it. Your ideas are like a joke filled with pus.

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Re: Totally Sad About "R" rating :-(
« Reply #38 on: May 22, 2008, 01:22:38 PM »
Unbroken, you need to calm down, we understand your point but you are going to far.  Your Unbreakable point holds no water, that was self defense, if he had gone in orginally and tried to arrest him, that would be one thing, but the man tried to murder him, then it becomes self defense.  You believe that you couldn't change Eli Roth's mind, I disagree.  I believe that we are instruments of God, and that he can use us to influence other people, you say that twisted people can't be saved, or shown the error of their ways, then how do you explain the murderers who become Christians, the pedophiles, those people who are considered the lowest of the low and can't be taught otherwise, that they must be removed from the world.  There are plenty of people who have changed.  Spiritually, what makes the difference between me and Eli Roth, I have incredibly twisted, violent dreams at times, but they always have a point, not to say that I would put some of the stuff in my dreams into a film, but the point is that my mind is capable of this dispicable action as much as Eli Roth's.  I have screwed up so many times in life, how am I different from Eli Roth, maybe on a physical, man made level, I haven't really broken any laws, at least not stuff worth condemning me for.  But spiritually, I have sinned against God and I am on equal footing with Eli Roth, I am no better, or worse, than him.  We have laws created to keep society in order, they are designed to protect us, but there are loopholes, you want to do something about Eli Roth, try and change the system.  Murder is murder, no matter the way it is done, maybe it is worse by man made standards when you tourture them, but you are still murdering them.  This world is sinful, you can't change that, yes, the gunk in our minds and the physical decay might be different, but you combat one thing, try and fight what you can and never give up, don't despair.  What do you mean America hasn't always been this way, it's always had humans, and humans aren't perfect, we are all sinful, we all mess things up, maybe it is more prevalent today, but it's no different then hundreds of years ago.  With your eliminate all sadists button, what do sadists include?  You have to follow the law that is set up in this country, you do not have power to condemn men unless they have broken laws.  I understand and respect your argument, but I heartfeltfully believe that you are going oveboard.
I see the world Lucius Hunt, just not the way you see it.


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Unbroken

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Re: Totally Sad About "R" rating :-(
« Reply #39 on: May 22, 2008, 01:24:05 PM »
WOW!!!!

I've heard that kind of stuff before, but not as severely as you put it! "my ideas are like a joke full of pus."  ;D

Haha... Okay let me make a few points.

Point number one: murder is the undeserved taking of someone's life. If Eli Roth deserves to have his life ended for the sick things he has done and the impact he has had on people's lives, then it isn't murder. If, however, Eli Roth has done nothing insanely evil, then YES, killing him is murder.

I'm not going to try to convince you that Eli Roth ought to die. I've already posted on the subject like five times dude.

Point number two: don't try to use my own religion against me. You think I don't know what the Bible says? It's obvious you don't. For one thing, "thou shalt not kill" is a common mistranslation. If the Bible really said that, Christians couldn't eat meat or fight in self-defense or any other situation. A more accurate translation is "thou shalt not murder". Maybe you think killing Eli Roth is murder, but according to the Bible, it isn't.

Read about the slaughter of the self-mutilating Baal priests in the Old Testament, buddy. And maybe from now on you should learn a little more about the basis of a person's belief before you try to use one measly passage to topple my argument.

Point number three: you think I'm arrogant? I didn't start this topic, trying to convince people here that we all need to start killing bad men. I made a statement dealing with my personal feelings, which was challenged by somebody else. I stepped up to the plate and defended my statement again and again and again. There's nothing wrong with that.

I'm sorry if I'm not wishy-washy enough for you to like me.

Point number four: I don't sound like M Night Shyamalan? I apolagize. Maybe you're wearing a bracelet that says "WWSD" (What Would Shyamalan Do) but I'm not.

Point numer five: look up "sadism" in the dictionary. Then watch an Eli Roth film. Then tell me to my face that the two things don't match up.


Now Mamasan, instead of turning this thread into my personal freak show, please PM me if you have anything more to say.

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Re: Totally Sad About "R" rating :-(
« Reply #40 on: May 22, 2008, 01:25:05 PM »
I see you just posted, Mr Glass 1.

I've gotta run but I'll read your post and reply to it later.

Dr Malcolm Crowe

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Re: Totally Sad About "R" rating :-(
« Reply #41 on: May 22, 2008, 01:51:49 PM »
Please continue all other posts on this matter through PMs, I am getting ready to lock the thread if I see it need be.